--- title: "Reason and Emotion in Labour Markets | Minna Helle | Negotiator 108" titleOriginal: "Työmarkkinoiden järki ja tunteet | Minna Helle | Neuvottelija 108" episodeNumber: "108" guest: "Minna Helle" datePublished: 2021-11-19 duration: "44:57" youtube: "https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEMop1rUG8w" originalLanguage: "fi" topics: ["negotiation","finnish_economy_policy"] subtitleMethod: "none" provenance: "Owner page assembled from YouTube metadata and the neuvottelija.fi episode record. No chapter marks are published here: the publisher's list holds only two marks, at 0:00 and 1:01, and it is a split of the show-note text rather than a chapter list, so republishing it would assert timestamps that do not hold. No transcript is published either — the channel has no English caption track for this episode and the Finnish one is YouTube's automatic track. The guest now represents employers and is assessing bargaining rounds she took part in from the union side; the trade unions she discusses are not represented in the episode. The technology industry settlement described was current in autumn 2021 and the bargaining model has since changed. Recorded 19 November 2021." fiCanonical: "https://www.neuvottelija.fi/fi/episodes/128-tyomarkkinoiden-jarki-ja-tunteet-minna-helle-neuvottelija-10" canonical: https://www.neuvottelija.com/podcast/episodes/ep108-tyomarkkinoiden-jarki-ja-tunteet-minna-helle/ --- # Reason and Emotion in Labour Markets | Minna Helle | Negotiator 108 English subtitles are not available on this page. This is an episode summary, not a curated transcript. ## Summary Minna Helle, deputy chief executive of Technology Industries of Finland, has seen the labour market from three sides: as chief negotiator for the nurses' union Tehy, as National Conciliator, and now from the employer side. The episode opens with what taught her most — the 2007 bargaining round, which she calls a collective delusion. The conversation covers the difference between an employment contract and a collective agreement, universal applicability and its design flaw, and the technology industry's autumn 2021 settlement and how it differed from the forest industry's line. The last part is about negotiation itself: a professional would have to choose reason, and nobody manages that in their own affairs — and people quarrel, issues do not. ## Three chairs Union chief negotiator, National Conciliator, employer. Very few people have sat in all three, and it is what makes her verdict on 2007 worth more than the usual retrospective: she is criticising a round she helped produce, from a position she has since left. ## A shared delusion, not a defeat Describing 2007 as a collective delusion puts the failure in the expectation both sides were working from rather than in anyone's tactics. That is a more useful diagnosis, because it predicts recurrence whenever the same expectation forms. ## People quarrel, issues do not The line the episode ends on, and the one that carries beyond labour relations. Its corollary is the uncomfortable admission that follows it: a professional ought to choose reason, and nobody manages it when the matter is their own. ## Watch The recording lives on the Neuvottelija channel: [Työmarkkinoiden järki ja tunteet | Minna Helle | Neuvottelija 108](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEMop1rUG8w). A Finnish edition of this episode is published at [www.neuvottelija.fi](https://www.neuvottelija.fi/fi/episodes/128-tyomarkkinoiden-jarki-ja-tunteet-minna-helle-neuvottelija-10). ## In depth The Neuvottelija AI editions carry a long-form write-up of this episode: [English](https://www.neuvottelija.com/ai/ep108-tyomarkkinoiden-jarki-ja-tunteet-minna-helle/) · [suomeksi](https://www.neuvottelija.fi/economy/ep108-tyomarkkinoiden-jarki-ja-tunteet-minna-helle/). ## Explore the ideas in depth - [Negotiation Strategy, Leverage and Power: Reading the Counterparty You Actually Have](https://www.neuvottelija.com/guides/negotiation-strategy-leverage-and-power/): A negotiation guide from the co-author of Neuvotteluvalta — the sources of leverage, BATNA and anchoring in practice, using information asymmetry, breaking deadlocks, and what to do when the counterparty negotiates on power rather than consensus. Grounded in Neuvottelija conversations and two decades of negotiation writing. - [New Negotiation Power: The Definitive English Framework](https://www.neuvottelija.com/guides/new-negotiation-power-framework/): The authoritative English presentation of Sami Miettinen and Juhana Torkki's New Negotiation Power framework: Power, Analytics, Interaction and Principles; preparation, roles, team design, trust and long-term negotiation performance. --- Cite as: Sami Miettinen, Neuvottelija — Reason and Emotion in Labour Markets | Minna Helle | Negotiator 108, https://www.neuvottelija.com/podcast/episodes/ep108-tyomarkkinoiden-jarki-ja-tunteet-minna-helle/, 2021-11-19. For quotes include episode 108 and timestamp.